Friends, Family & Carers Forum

[Beermoney]

Hello i new to this site, n feel that i have no where else to go. This will read like a short novel but i need to get it out .... so here it goes.<br><br>I'm 37 y.o. male living with a parnter Mimi 36 y.o. My parnter has a 12 year old daughter (who lives with her father during the week n us on weekends). So this is the break down.<br><br>I started dating my partner Mimi about 3 years ago 11th july 2014. We met on a dating website n really hit it off. When we first starting talking she told me that she was still married but separated from her husband (Brian). She also informed me that she moved out of thier house, n that her daughter lives with the father most of the time. And that they have an agreement where she can come visit when ever she likes. To me this seemed strange that a mother would not fight to take her daughter in a separation, but i never questioned her over it as that was between her n her exhusband. So just around christmas 2014 we had a fight. Mimi had found messages in my fone from a FWB that i had been seeing b4 her. She asked me about the girl, n i told her about it. Explained that was someone b4 we met. She got mad and said that i was cheating on her. That i was messaging this girl behind her back. Yet she found these messages by snooping n going through my fone. When we argued i said that if i wanted to hide the messages i would deleted them. But she just ignored that and said "not telling me about her is liying" n that "hiding the messages is cheating as well as lying". I just let it go. She was very upset n i didnt want her to get any more upset. So fast forward to jan 2015. Again she snooped through my fone n found facebook messages from a girl. The messages were 5 years ago b5 i met Mimi. Again she was angry that i didn't tell her about them. I said that i didn't even know they were there. And that snooping is not healthy in a relationship. That if u go looking for negativity long n hard enough you will find it. Again she said that i was lying. So from this her perspective was me lying to her. So now fast forward to june 2015 i dropped myself into hot water when i told her that a friend of mine name Toni was female. See from her previously snooping she would have seen the messages/texts n not said anything because Toni only ever talked about footy. See Toni was a family friend that i have known for years b4 Mimi. Now the problem here was clear to me. Mimi had insecurity issues with other females in my life. She accused me of cheating on her with Toni. This arguement got way outa hand. I tried to tell her that Toni was just a friend. But allls she would repeat is that u lied b4 n now you are lying again. So to keep her happy i called Toni n put her on speaker fone. Toni was shocked that i called outa the blue. We only talked via text and always about footy. But i asked Toni straight out. "Is there anything fishy going on between you n me? Have we ever had a fling or a relationship?".... Toni laughed and answred "stop being an idiot, why would you call me to ask me that?". I said "coz Mimi thinks im cheating on her with you". To which Toni replied "wat? Dont be silly, she must have some under lying issue's there". Mimi flew into a rage yelling at Toni who was on speaker fone. Mimi said "stay the f@#k away from my BF you sl*t". And this point i hung up the fone. Turned to Mimi and asked where did that come from??? She said nothing n walked off angry. She cooled off a day later n things went back to normal. By normal i mean no fights, no temper outrages, no depression. Just like nothing had ever happened. Now fast forward to Aug 2015. We were talking about her still being married. The topic of how her n her husband share custody. I said "you know that one day Brian could find a parnter n the way things are now will change"... "brians' new partner will be his priority over you"... she got angry n said "me n brian have an arrangement n thats not going to change no matter wat". I said ok n left it at that. Now fast forward to Aug 2016. Brian shows up to pick his daughter up like every sunday. Only this day he handed over divorce papers. He said "you dont have to sign them. But i already have n its payed for. So for your own piece of mind go get it signed". Then he left. She came inside n fell apart. I couldnt understand why she was so upset. Her and Brian had been separated for 5 years. Brian was moving on with his life. Now here is where it gets real crazy. Brian dropped the divorce papers aug 2016, september 2016 he dropped the bomb. "Mimi i have a partner n she is moving into the house with me". Again Mimi went mental, saying i don't know Alex n i don't want her around my daughter if i dont know her". To which Brian replied "we have been dating for 8 months n Andrea has already met her, im just letting you know thats all". So this all happened in a space of 2 months. The divorce papers&gt; new partner &gt; alex moving in. Mimi was that outa control we went to the doctors. I went with her into see the doctor. Alls he did was give her a sleeping tablet n some Vallium. Pretty much said take these n you will feel better. N sent us on our way. So come October 2016 Mimi wanted to have a child with me. Reluctant i agreed. I thought her mindset was all over the place with the divorce. But she fell pregnant mid October 2016 n miscarriaged mid November 2016. This again hit her hard. Alls i could do was be there for her. Just be an ear to vent to n a shoulder to cry on. So now move forward to Xmas 2016. We went to my parents house. Only this was the first xmas without her daughter. Brian had Andrea with his partner for xmas. Another thing that crushed mimi. Again i felt hopless.... wat was i to do. So with all that i have mentioned on 25th January 2017 she just hit me with i want to break up. I asked why? She said that i was never there for her through the Alex/Brian saga. I wasn't there for her through the divorce. It was like she was blaming me for everything that ever went wrong in the relationship. N even to this day she still drags up the lie at the start of the relastionship saying she cant trust me. She thinks that im not there for her. Saying im useless n pathetic. And she never ever takes responsibility for herself. She is never wrong. She never admits to doing anything wrong. She says that she has never lied. N never lied to me. Im at breaking point. When i suggested about going to see a couples counsellor. She said "i don't need to go see anyone, i know there is nothing wrong with me". Again she was mad at me. Throughout the relationship she has even been sent home from work coz she has just started crying. I ask why n she says she doesn't know. From my point of view n pain wrenching time with her. She has some type of disorder... some type of illness like BPD, PMDD or Bipolar. Anything or everytine i have mentioned anything closely related to crazy, unstable or out right mental. She flies into a rage n twist wat ever i say around n always goes back to "you lied to me, i cant trust you. You are a liar". I really do care about her n i do think there are some issues she needs help with. So wat do i do??? Walk away n let her live like this the rest of her life thinking how she treats people is normal?? Between her husband n me she dated 3 other guys. All 3 said she had Bipolar. According to her anyway. N throughout our 3 years together she has always tried baiting me into saying she has it. But i have never said it. Never agreed to her baiting comnent. Its like she is wanting me to say it just coz the others have. <br><br>So wat do i do. I have done extensive research on PMDD n BPD. I do believe that there is a high possibility she has something that could be managed by medication.<br><br>Any help or advice would be much appreciated. I am losing my mind.<br>

[BeHappy]

Hi @Beermoney,

My heart goes out to you. It's clear that you really love your partner, and have bent over backwards to help her throughout your years together. You've stood by her despite her accusations, and going through your phones.

It seems to me that relationships bring up a lot for her. As you mentioned, she in insecure of other women, which I think suggests that being intimate with someone raises a lot of anxiety and trust within in her. I can't imagine how distressing this is for.

At the same time, she is lacking insight into how her behaviour impacts on you, and how it contributes to situations. She really isn't owning any of this. The difficult thing is until she can own some of it, she will probably expect the changes to come from you, seeing she believes she's done nothing.

Are there things you can do @Beermoney from her perspective to make the relatonships work? Would you be willing to do these things? And would you be ok for her to continue blaming you for the relationship downfalls when things get tough?

[Beermoney]

@BeHappy see the thing for me is i have never been in a relationship like this b4. I have never had to cope with a mental illness directly. N to be honest, at times i feel like im going crazy. Her logic is always black n white. She never has any grey areas in the thinking process or in any cognitive process. Everything is always all good or all bad. I see just be her actions she never accepts the good with the bad or vice versa.

I do believe she has had these issues her whole life, even in past relationships. I also believe that she too has bern cheated on to have her trust damaged so badly. Wat i dont understand is why she is so hell bent on believeing just black n white. Is BPD that straight forward??

Another point is that i have been going to therapy for about a month now. The counsellor said that i possibly have developed Codependent disorder. I have lost myself in her by bending to her ever whim. Waiting on her hand n foot. Even the simple things like getting something from the fridge for her, even though she is closer.

The counsellor said i have n am enabling her behavior. Which i know is true. I just find it hard to say no to her, or just agree to avoid a massive fight.

I'm codependent, n i hate thats who i have become. I don't really do anything for myself. Its usually doing watever she wants. I really have lost who i am, my purpose feels like it will disappear is she is not around.

In a nut shell im scared to be alone. Coming home to a house without her terrifies me. I realise that her behavior is toxic when she is in a bad mood. But we have created some great memories over the last 3 years. So with the thought of leaving her also comes the realisation of not creating any more memories with her.

I strongly do believe that she has BPD becsuse the traits n symptoms always seem present from my point of view. So i keep asking myself why is she so against going to see a counsellor??? Like i said earlier, she gets so angry n defensive just at the mention of it?? Is that a sign she is hiding an illness/disorder???

Most friends n family have told me its ok to walk away. Telling me that she will have a very very lonely life. It breaks my heart to even think about her being alone. That's not wat i want for her.

In this situation is it still possible to be her friend?? Or do i remove myself completely from her life?

Again, any advice is appricated

[Former-Member]

@Beermoney   I read this and I start to shake.  I feel weak and terrified. I have been in your shoes. I too had no prior first hand experience with MI of any kind (that I know of) before experiencing a "BPD" sufferer.  Yes I know you have stated she does not have a formal diagnosis but I will write this based on my experience, where he did.  This was my first venture into the Carer forums and I came across your post and just had to reply.  I hope that is ok.  Here is my novella in response to your entry.

I tried and tried and tried to make sense of a "BPD" sufferer.  I don't wish to offend anyone but I do think some BPD sufferers just cannot be helped, I also think there is a level of ignorance when assessing for the formal diagnosis. I speak only from experience but it is years of it and many heart wrenching moments that lead me to diligent and extensive research.

The "BPD" sufferers that lack empathy, the ones that think only in black and white, the ones that can't see the rationale of compromise or continuously promise but don't deliver on change,  will suck you dry and leave you reeling; worse still if they also display traits of pathological or habitual lying

I'm not sure if some BPD sufferers are misdiagnosed.  I know there is a lot of overlap in cluster B personality disorders.   I do think some people, especially those with other overlapping MI, are best to run away from.

I learnt the hard way with an officially diagnosed "BPD" sufferer, that some act more like they suffer ASPD than the traumatic emotional abandonment issues so predominant in more mid range BPD sufferers.

If some level of self awareness is present, I believe the BPD sufferer is easier to help and less likely to drag the carer into the "rabbit hole". 

But the less empathetic, more narcissistic types need to have a cut off point. Once it becomes apparent that more help, no matter how well intentioned,  is obviously not going to change the dynamic, to stay sane it is time to walk away.

I know, from experience, the biggest mistake I made was believing things would get better.  To be too comfortable, too determined that I could help because I am smart, I am intelligent, empathetic, rational and compromising.  I learnt the hard way, just short of paying the ultimate price (losing my life) in fact, that some "BPD " sufferers cannot be helped . I think the whole diagnosis process needs to be further investigated and researched because some so called BPD sufferers give others a bad name and are very different cats.

I realsie you say your partner has not been diagnosed, but look at what you are dealing with and decide for yourself.  Do things improve or are you stuck in a nightmare ground hog day scenario no matter how much you try?

If it is the latter.  I cannot advise strongly enough to assess the situation for what it is and make the decision for you.  Otherwise it may be you that will not be fine in the long run.  

You already talk of losing your identity.  I lost mine, it was sucked out of me.  I am not the person I was . I have spent years struggling to get back to 'me".  Don't do what I did.  Don't think you can help where sadly, you just can't. I tried for 14 years, solid. Despite terrrible things being done, I always believed somehow he would "wake up" and follow through on our endless discussions on how things could be fixed and the steps we should take to make it better  He agreed every tiime, and reverted every time -  as soon as things didn't go in his favour, even the smallest trigger would turn him irrational.

Admittedly, I was dealing with an extreme case, I can't even tell people some of the things he did because even to me they are not only unbelievable I am embarrassed to have lived them, I am embarrassed to have hoped they were anomalies. 

At first I didn't know what I was dealing with, I heard the term Borderline when he flippantly told me of his diagnosis and ignorantly chalked it up to something trivial.  Borderline.. well not just near something.

Anyhow, he is still the same as he was when I met him.  Worse in fact ,because he has had inadvertent enablers but he is able to cloak his true nature, like a chameleon and many would defend him. 

In your case it seems a very different situation because others see the problems you face, and that is a very good thing and makes a lot of difference.

Do what you know by instinct you should and trust what you see and what you feel. Assess it as objectively as you can and even if the decsiion is the hard one, do it, before it consumes you.

[Beermoney]

Thanks for the advice. I appreciate reading all the help o can get.

I do feel lost though with how she was able to mask it from me. People say love is blind and i guess it was true for me.

I have moved out of the house and am living with some friends now. But i still miss her, i haven't talked to her in about 4 weeks. But if i am truely going to cut all ties i still need to go back to the house to collect my stuff. And this scares me a little with not knowing how she will react.

See friends have warned me that with her BPD she could snap and really go violent. She has never been violent towards me b4 but they said if she catches wind that you are moving on. This could trigger her into a rage. And things could get outa control.

I just wish things could have been different. At least convince her to go talk to someone. Everybody has problems n everybody needs help from time to time. But its just her lack of ownership to her behavior and unwillingness to change her behaviors. Surely she must see a pattern accruing here with partners. Or does BPD really cloud that cognitive processing ability that bad.

I explained in another post about her black n white thinking or reasoning skills. I still to this day struggle to comprehend how it's possible not to have a "grey area" when thinking. With her it was/is always all good or all bad. Never taking the good with the bad and vice-versa.

Another thing i have discovered with BPD is cheating. Maybe it's just a coincidence but a lot of articles, posts and threads people seem to mention their BPD partners stray. Or get bored n lead them to stray.

Again thankyou for the help.

[Former-Member]

@Beermoney  I know. I know exactly what you are talking about. Believe me.

it never gets better, the hardest part is reconciling what was unmasked with the mask and forgiving yourself for "falling" for it.

You have done the right thing, In your words, you describe my inability to understand why he could not "wake up" because it just all seemed so simple to me for him to see the ridiculousness and change it. It wasn't, it was impossible for him. It's still hard for me to wrap my head around that. But it truly is their state of mind.

Oh yes the cheating, oh don't even get me thinking of that it will trigger me! That took me soooo long to get over, the first time sent me into a fog that lasted for years, the cruel way it was done. It was inhuman.

He totally lacked self awareness, I found myself having to explain the most obvious outcomes and consequences. Nothing, I mean nothing was ever his fault (according to him) or he might acquiesce but it was manipulation to placate nothing resonated in reality.  To this day I am not 100% sure if it was contrived or real. If it was contrived it was one of his favourite games that's for sure. I kind of prefer to think he was just oblivious, but I don't know, he was certainly devious enough for it to be feigned just so he could get the attention I gave him for it.

[Beermoney]

See there is something i never mentioned in my other posts.

So let me just explain our last week together.

We broke up on Jan 25th (which was a wednesday). The day b4 Australia Day Jan 26th (public holiday). Now to this very day i don't know exactly where she went that nite n i guess i never will. My gut tells me she went to meet up with another guy. But i have no exact proof.

See that Wednesday she came home around 5pm from work. I was already at home as i finished at 3pm. From the moment she walked in the door she seemed to be in a foul mood. So around 6.30pm while outside smoking she said. "We need to break up". It was outa nowhere n i was stunned and not sure wat to say.

So from that we argued a little but nothing crazy. I was so upset i jumped in my car a left. My world had just come crashing down.

So i drove around my city for about 2hrs thinking my head was going to explode. After i got myself together i drove home. When i walked inside she was gone.

So i text her. She messaged back saying she went to a friends house. See she only has one friend here where we live. And i mean that literally one friend.

I thought nothing of it n went to bed thinking she would be home later that nite. But she never came home till 10am the next morning. I asked her why she didn't come home. She replied "we are not together anymore n i don't have to answer that".

Yes she was technicly right, but i thought that was a slap in the face being we had been together for some time.

So my gut instincts kicked in and i called her best friend and asked her did my GF stay at your house last nite. To which she replied a hesitate no.

With that being said i asked my GF where she stayed, she said at her friends house. So i told her that BS coz i was just talking to you best friend n she said u were never there.

So to this day i have no idea where she stayed, my gut instincts tells me she cheated on me. But only she would ever know that answer. Its one that chews me up inside. The idea that she broke up with me n then in less then 4 hrs later was sleeping with another guy.

I want her to just be honest n tell me that she cheated on me so i can hate her n move on faster. Well it would bring closure to me n piece on mind.

[Former-Member]

@Beermoney  well here's something coincidental. I had a marriage proposal from him, and 4 hours later he sent me evidence of him being with another woman. To this day there has not been the slightest explanation of how or why that happened.

Thankfully, by then I had realised what he was like and didn't really take the proposal completely seriously (maybe that is why I got punished) but I didn't say no.  So how does it go from asking someone to marry you, to sending them evidence of sexual escapades with another women in less than 3 or 4  hours? Rhetorical... it doesn't even need answering. 😛 

There was no fight no nothing, he had just left the house to go.. I forget where..  and out of the blue txts and pictures started to arrive.  I was like wth??  I couldn't even really get my head around what I was seeing or what was happening I just kind of gaped at them and went into a fog trying to work out what I was looking at.

[katie]

@Beermoney
Wow. So reading yr story made me so upset yet so thankful that im not alone. Yr story is so similar to mine. I cop the blame for their bad choices and fallout... i am the one always trying to rescue and clear up the mess thats created. Im the crazy one etc etc.. that finger is constantly pointing in my direction... never theirs. I love deeply and unconditionally but seem to have also been so cauggt up out of love and fear..that ive lost myself too and am also probably codependent. My bpd is currently in another downward cycle.. but in N's case.. usually goes hand in hand with a break up (now 8wks ago) and drug use. I never know if this time is the end or not. 5 years now and..all behaviors listed regularly and then once a year for last 3 years..the big break up.. complete emotional detachment.. (although not willing to completely cut contact)which usually 3months ish..returns with im sorry and ill work hard to get better. Its so damaging to the bpd partner.. but the thing is.. ive read n read and rhere simply isnt much or ANY that i can find..help for US. how is yr situation now???